GraphicDisorder
+1y
Our Back up solutions are pretty solid here. Each PC has a main drive with the OS/Programs on it. Each PC has a second internal drive with data. Each PC has a external HD that copies the internal data drive. From that point the server at night copies each PC's OS and Data drive (not the external). So each PC has its data in 3 different places at any time. This happens every night. To add to that the server keeps months of data, so if I need to find a file but have changed the file, and need to know what it looks liked 2 months ago, no problem I can go get that.
Our Back up solutions are pretty solid here. Each PC has a main drive with the OS/Programs on it. Each PC has a second internal drive with data. Each PC has a external HD that copies the internal data drive. From that point the server at night copies each PC's OS and Data drive (not the external). So each PC has its data in 3 different places at any time. This happens every night. To add to that the server keeps months of data, so if I need to find a file but have changed the file, and need to know what it looks liked 2 months ago, no problem I can go get that.
DougyFrisch
+1y
Edited: 8/30/2009 2:58:00 PM by DougyFrisch
here's a cookie... hope u like chocolate chip... I'll stick to my mac... a PC is a PC to me, regardless what it's got behind it. Mine do exactly what i want em to do and they do it very well... Anyway, back to the subject of the thread... you gonna spill the beans Ben, i'm interested to know what your using.
here's a cookie... hope u like chocolate chip... I'll stick to my mac... a PC is a PC to me, regardless what it's got behind it. Mine do exactly what i want em to do and they do it very well... Anyway, back to the subject of the thread... you gonna spill the beans Ben, i'm interested to know what your using.
GraphicDisorder
+1y
---------------------------------------------Originally posted by DougyFrischEdited: 8/30/2009 2:58:00 PM by DougyFrischhere's a cookie... hope u like chocolate chip... I'll stick to my mac... a PC is a PC to me, regardless what it's got behind it. Mine do exactly what i want em to do and they do it very well... Anyway, back to the subject of the thread... you gonna spill the beans Ben, i'm interested to know what your using. ---------------------------------------------Keep your cookie, a Mac is a Mac to me. I bought the second most powerfull Mac Book they made at the time (last feb) and its not enough power for me. Slow 5400rpm hard drive, only came with 2gb of ram. I had to upgrade mine to 4gb of ram to be able to do anything worth a shit and I still find it just slow in comparison. Something about quad core (8 if you count hyperthreading), 10krpm hard drive, and 12gb of DDR3 probably helps.......lol.
---------------------------------------------Originally posted by DougyFrischEdited: 8/30/2009 2:58:00 PM by DougyFrischhere's a cookie... hope u like chocolate chip... I'll stick to my mac... a PC is a PC to me, regardless what it's got behind it. Mine do exactly what i want em to do and they do it very well... Anyway, back to the subject of the thread... you gonna spill the beans Ben, i'm interested to know what your using. ---------------------------------------------Keep your cookie, a Mac is a Mac to me. I bought the second most powerfull Mac Book they made at the time (last feb) and its not enough power for me. Slow 5400rpm hard drive, only came with 2gb of ram. I had to upgrade mine to 4gb of ram to be able to do anything worth a shit and I still find it just slow in comparison. Something about quad core (8 if you count hyperthreading), 10krpm hard drive, and 12gb of DDR3 probably helps.......lol.
DougyFrisch
+1y
Ya...i'm not one to get into a Mac/PC debate... but you mean to tell me your comparing your quad core 12 gig machine to a macbook? your comparing apples to oranges... (no pun intended lol) You might as well be comparing your machine to a damn Dell Inspiron, no contest right? how about the comparable MacPro... -Two 2.26GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon -32GB (8x4GB) 1066MHz DDR3 -1TB 7200-rpm 3Gb/s -1TB 7200-rpm 3Gb/s -ATI Radeon HD 4870 512MB Now get behind that machine and tell me how it stacks up to your Ferrari of a PC... and i understand this machine comes with a pretty price tag, but you gotta pay to play... and i'm sure you've put a pretty penny into your machines, too much money to be comparing it to a $1200 macbook for sure. So again, PC and Macs are personal preferences, but you gotta make sure when you bad mouth apple that your comparing to correctly. I'm sorry you were disappointed with your MacBook, but your using it for exactly what it's made for, general use. If you want a design machine get a iMac or MacPro.
GraphicDisorder
+1y
Edited: 8/31/2009 1:19:05 PM by SSM-Brandt
---------------------------------------------Originally posted by DougyFrischYa...i'm not one to get into a Mac/PC debate... but you mean to tell me your comparing your quad core 12 gig machine to a macbook? your comparing apples to oranges... (no pun intended lol) You might as well be comparing your machine to a damn Dell Inspiron, no contest right? how about the comparable MacPro... -Two 2.26GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon-32GB (8x4GB) 1066MHz DDR3-1TB 7200-rpm 3Gb/s-1TB 7200-rpm 3Gb/s-ATI Radeon HD 4870 512MB Now get behind that machine and tell me how it stacks up to your Ferrari of a PC... and i understand this machine comes with a pretty price tag, but you gotta pay to play... and i'm sure you've put a pretty penny into your machines, too much money to be comparing it to a $1200 macbook for sure. So again, PC and Macs are personal preferences, but you gotta make sure when you bad mouth apple that your comparing to correctly. I'm sorry you were disappointed with your MacBook, but your using it for exactly what it's made for, general use. If you want a design machine get a iMac or MacPro. --------------------------------------------- Wait your calling me out for comparing apples to oranges then you throw out a dual quad core machine, with 32gb of ram and two slow hard drives and a weak gpu vs a single quad core machine with nearly a third of the ram faster drives and a better GPU. Hello pot, meet kettle. BTW apple also wants like 9k just for the ram in that machine your configuring, you can talk all day about configuring this or that, you dont have one so why all the talk about what you can configure. You know the i7's are the same processor they use in the Mac Pros right? Look it up, they change the name on them when they toss them in the Mac Pros but they are the same Processor. Do a google. My MacBook PRO was $2200, not $1200, for a Mac fan boy you'd think you know the prices of the machines lol. My i7 machine if you count my 30 inch 2560x1600 monitor and 24 inch monitor would be over the price of a MacBook Pro sure, but not drastically, the performance difference however is very drasticly better on the PC. I am not disappointed with it at all, I think its a much better LAPTOP than most any Windows Laptop for one main reason. Multi-touch pad, however it is no faster than my HP laptop, and its way slower than several of my desktops. iMac carry the same intel core 2 duos processor as the Macbook Pro Dougy the performance will be barely different, if anything just slightly slower as a Laptop will always be trying to save power when you are not actively using it. Did you know there are very few applications that can even take advantage of dual processors. Did you also know that a Mac Pro with single proc will sometimes OUT bench a dual proc machine, this happens on many apps, not all sure, but many. You can find benches on this also on google. As for comparisons, lets do that. Whats single proc Mac Pro today? $2500 think, comes with 3gb of ram doesn't it. and like a single 640 drive. For around 1800 I built a PC with the same processor, 4x the ram, 2x the memory on the GPU, 2 hard drives one being a 10krpm drive and so on. Dougy to add some humor to this conversation why dont you tell us about the computer you have.
---------------------------------------------Originally posted by DougyFrischYa...i'm not one to get into a Mac/PC debate... but you mean to tell me your comparing your quad core 12 gig machine to a macbook? your comparing apples to oranges... (no pun intended lol) You might as well be comparing your machine to a damn Dell Inspiron, no contest right? how about the comparable MacPro... -Two 2.26GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon-32GB (8x4GB) 1066MHz DDR3-1TB 7200-rpm 3Gb/s-1TB 7200-rpm 3Gb/s-ATI Radeon HD 4870 512MB Now get behind that machine and tell me how it stacks up to your Ferrari of a PC... and i understand this machine comes with a pretty price tag, but you gotta pay to play... and i'm sure you've put a pretty penny into your machines, too much money to be comparing it to a $1200 macbook for sure. So again, PC and Macs are personal preferences, but you gotta make sure when you bad mouth apple that your comparing to correctly. I'm sorry you were disappointed with your MacBook, but your using it for exactly what it's made for, general use. If you want a design machine get a iMac or MacPro. --------------------------------------------- Wait your calling me out for comparing apples to oranges then you throw out a dual quad core machine, with 32gb of ram and two slow hard drives and a weak gpu vs a single quad core machine with nearly a third of the ram faster drives and a better GPU. Hello pot, meet kettle. BTW apple also wants like 9k just for the ram in that machine your configuring, you can talk all day about configuring this or that, you dont have one so why all the talk about what you can configure. You know the i7's are the same processor they use in the Mac Pros right? Look it up, they change the name on them when they toss them in the Mac Pros but they are the same Processor. Do a google. My MacBook PRO was $2200, not $1200, for a Mac fan boy you'd think you know the prices of the machines lol. My i7 machine if you count my 30 inch 2560x1600 monitor and 24 inch monitor would be over the price of a MacBook Pro sure, but not drastically, the performance difference however is very drasticly better on the PC. I am not disappointed with it at all, I think its a much better LAPTOP than most any Windows Laptop for one main reason. Multi-touch pad, however it is no faster than my HP laptop, and its way slower than several of my desktops. iMac carry the same intel core 2 duos processor as the Macbook Pro Dougy the performance will be barely different, if anything just slightly slower as a Laptop will always be trying to save power when you are not actively using it. Did you know there are very few applications that can even take advantage of dual processors. Did you also know that a Mac Pro with single proc will sometimes OUT bench a dual proc machine, this happens on many apps, not all sure, but many. You can find benches on this also on google. As for comparisons, lets do that. Whats single proc Mac Pro today? $2500 think, comes with 3gb of ram doesn't it. and like a single 640 drive. For around 1800 I built a PC with the same processor, 4x the ram, 2x the memory on the GPU, 2 hard drives one being a 10krpm drive and so on. Dougy to add some humor to this conversation why dont you tell us about the computer you have.
DougyFrisch
+1y
Edited: 8/31/2009 4:06:47 PM by DougyFrisch
Dougy to add some humor to this conversation why dont you tell us about the computer you have. --------------------------------------------- Exactly why i don't get into these debates, lol... you just rambled off a bunch of specs and whatnot that mean nothing to me, and i'm certainly not here to tell you mine is better then yours. there is no convincing one or the other on which is "better", it's just beating a dead horse really.... but yes, i didn't jump the gun and configured a MacPro with 32 gigs of ram, but at least thats a lil more realistic then you comparing it to a MacBook laptop! i have a MacBook and yes, i hate it... i use it for watching movies in the living room and browsing the internet in bed also. thats it and that's what they are made for... But to make all this shit even more unnecessary is the simple fact that fast is fast, period. you can keep droppin more ram and speed up your hard drives all you want, but it really comes down to if you click something, it does it and without hesitation. I mean what do you work on all day that needs that kind of power? Honestly, if your doing video work, then by all means cram in the power and go to town. I did video for 3 years and it was like watching paint dry when it came to rendering the video, the extra power would have helped... But come on now, we both design flyers, biz cards, shirts, stickers, signs, banners, etc all day long. Now i can't tell you the last time i went to go work on a project and i was frustrated with how slow my machine was. I never see the spinning dial, ever. when i click it jumps, no hesitation. Now maybe when it comes to initially opening the file, then yes, it takes 20 seconds, whoop... I even design my wraps on this machine and hardly have a hick-up when i'm working on them, my machine runs just fine, even if it does have a stupid apple logo on the front... Now to humor you, for whatever reason... i didn't realize my machines were such a joke that it became funny, but it's whatever.(1) 24" iMac 2.66 GHz Core 2 Duo 4 Gigs DDR3 Ram NVIDIA GeForce 9400 1TB internal drive 1TB external mirrored to 2 drives via Firewire 800 (1) 24" iMac 2.8 GHz Core 2 Duo Second 22" Monitor 4 Gigs DDR2 Ram ATI Radeon HD 2600 1TB internal drive Wacom Intuos 3 Tablet And not to mention, i still don't have the ego that comes with having a custom built PC... So u can keep rambling off all the specs and geeky mumbo jumbo you want, but it still comes down to personal preference... and knowing what you got gets the job done regardless of what someone else has...Oh ya... almost for the blazing fast 2.4Ghz, 1 gig, with windows XP to run the PLOTTER, lol
Dougy to add some humor to this conversation why dont you tell us about the computer you have. --------------------------------------------- Exactly why i don't get into these debates, lol... you just rambled off a bunch of specs and whatnot that mean nothing to me, and i'm certainly not here to tell you mine is better then yours. there is no convincing one or the other on which is "better", it's just beating a dead horse really.... but yes, i didn't jump the gun and configured a MacPro with 32 gigs of ram, but at least thats a lil more realistic then you comparing it to a MacBook laptop! i have a MacBook and yes, i hate it... i use it for watching movies in the living room and browsing the internet in bed also. thats it and that's what they are made for... But to make all this shit even more unnecessary is the simple fact that fast is fast, period. you can keep droppin more ram and speed up your hard drives all you want, but it really comes down to if you click something, it does it and without hesitation. I mean what do you work on all day that needs that kind of power? Honestly, if your doing video work, then by all means cram in the power and go to town. I did video for 3 years and it was like watching paint dry when it came to rendering the video, the extra power would have helped... But come on now, we both design flyers, biz cards, shirts, stickers, signs, banners, etc all day long. Now i can't tell you the last time i went to go work on a project and i was frustrated with how slow my machine was. I never see the spinning dial, ever. when i click it jumps, no hesitation. Now maybe when it comes to initially opening the file, then yes, it takes 20 seconds, whoop... I even design my wraps on this machine and hardly have a hick-up when i'm working on them, my machine runs just fine, even if it does have a stupid apple logo on the front... Now to humor you, for whatever reason... i didn't realize my machines were such a joke that it became funny, but it's whatever.(1) 24" iMac 2.66 GHz Core 2 Duo 4 Gigs DDR3 Ram NVIDIA GeForce 9400 1TB internal drive 1TB external mirrored to 2 drives via Firewire 800 (1) 24" iMac 2.8 GHz Core 2 Duo Second 22" Monitor 4 Gigs DDR2 Ram ATI Radeon HD 2600 1TB internal drive Wacom Intuos 3 Tablet And not to mention, i still don't have the ego that comes with having a custom built PC... So u can keep rambling off all the specs and geeky mumbo jumbo you want, but it still comes down to personal preference... and knowing what you got gets the job done regardless of what someone else has...Oh ya... almost for the blazing fast 2.4Ghz, 1 gig, with windows XP to run the PLOTTER, lol
GraphicDisorder
+1y
---------------------------------------------Originally posted by DougyFrischEdited: 8/31/2009 4:06:47 PM by DougyFrischDougy to add some humor to this conversation why dont you tell us about the computer you have. --------------------------------------------- Exactly why i don't get into these debates, lol... you just rambled off a bunch of specs and whatnot that mean nothing to me, and i'm certainly not here to tell you mine is better then yours. there is no convincing one or the other on which is "better", it's just beating a dead horse really.... but yes, i didn't jump the gun and configured a MacPro with 32 gigs of ram, but at least thats a lil more realistic then you comparing it to a MacBook laptop! i have a MacBook and yes, i hate it... i use it for watching movies in the living room and browsing the internet in bed also. thats it and that's what they are made for... But to make all this shit even more unnecessary is the simple fact that fast is fast, period. you can keep droppin more ram and speed up your hard drives all you want, but it really comes down to if you click something, it does it and without hesitation. I mean what do you work on all day that needs that kind of power? Honestly, if your doing video work, then by all means cram in the power and go to town. I did video for 3 years and it was like watching paint dry when it came to rendering the video, the extra power would have helped... But come on now, we both design flyers, biz cards, shirts, stickers, signs, banners, etc all day long. Now i can't tell you the last time i went to go work on a project and i was frustrated with how slow my machine was. I never see the spinning dial, ever. when i click it jumps, no hesitation. Now maybe when it comes to initially opening the file, then yes, it takes 20 seconds, whoop... I even design my wraps on this machine and hardly have a hick-up when i'm working on them, my machine runs just fine, even if it does have a stupid apple logo on the front... Now to humor you, for whatever reason... i didn't realize my machines were such a joke that it became funny, but it's whatever.(1) 24" iMac 2.66 GHz Core 2 Duo 4 Gigs DDR3 RamNVIDIA GeForce 94001TB internal drive1TB external mirrored to 2 drives via Firewire 800 (1) 24" iMac 2.8 GHz Core 2 DuoSecond 22" Monitor 4 Gigs DDR2 RamATI Radeon HD 26001TB internal drive Wacom Intuos 3 Tablet And not to mention, i still don't have the ego that comes with having a custom built PC... So u can keep rambling off all the specs and geeky mumbo jumbo you want, but it still comes down to personal preference... and knowing what you got gets the job done regardless of what someone else has...Oh ya... almost for the blazing fast 2.4Ghz, 1 gig, with windows XP to run the PLOTTER, lol ---------------------------------------------I asked what you use because I want to know what you have so I can know what you assume to be fast, I have played with serveral iMacs, they are nice machines. They are still a dual core machine, not earth shattering performance. What your saying is like trying to tell someone a V8 is not faster than a 4 banger. One thing you probably should learn about is disk read/write speed. Thats a huge bottle neck for PC and Mac alike. I over come that by buiding my own machines, trust me, youve never seen fast untill you use SSD drives or 10krpm drives. If you think you have your wrong. Use them and come back and tell me adding ram and hard drives dont make a difference. I certainly didn't mention it to get into a pissing contest or for ego. But I have built computers for around 10 years now. Went to school for computers, and build many a year for friends/familly. I dont hate my Macbook Pro, I just find it has a place, and its not as my main computer. It is slow in contrast. My computer is fast period as well, faster than the mac pro I tinkered with at several 2 mac stores. I am sure they would be quicker with faster hard drives and some more ram. One day I was in the Apple store when I bought my Beats by Dre head phones. I opened photoshop and created a "new" file 50x100 inches at 450dpi, drew a single black to white gradiant, the machine took several minutes. Ill be fair there were several programs open. However I can open many on mine and do the same thing and it happens almost instantly. Maybe something was wrong with it. Ya we do similar things with our computers, however I probably do them for much longer than you as I would have to imagine you have a real job and a social life. I have neither and work 7 days a week 14hrs a day and have been for 8 years now. So if my computer can be faster and I get a business write off in the process, I am all about it. So of course I will build top shelf computers, of course I will have epic hard drives, of course I will have tons of ram, I personally find them to be worth the money and not expensive. its 200 bucks for 12gb of DDR3 ram, why woudln't I buy that much? Thats cheap. Ive never been frustrated with how slow any PC I have had was, I do know when it can be faster, same as 5 minutes after you buy any brand computer some newer model is already in the works with faster this and faster that. I happen to keep up with that curve because I find it fun, and rewarding. See unlike many fan boys of either flavor or any type of product I like to try both. Ived tried Macs, more than one time. They are great computers, for me they do nothing faster, they work with less software, they are drastically harder to repair since if something DOES go wrong you ahve to take it to a store and deal with that. They are more expensive for no real performance gain if you are comparing same specs to same specs. Do they look cooler, sure. Its just like with phones, I had a windows mobile phone. I found it crap, so I have iPhones now. 2 times ive bought iPhones in fact. I dont hate Apple, ive just yet to see a dollar for dollar Apple out perform a PC. Use your Macs, I think Macs are great, I will keep using both, so I can have a real open mind about what really is better. HAHA.
---------------------------------------------Originally posted by DougyFrischEdited: 8/31/2009 4:06:47 PM by DougyFrischDougy to add some humor to this conversation why dont you tell us about the computer you have. --------------------------------------------- Exactly why i don't get into these debates, lol... you just rambled off a bunch of specs and whatnot that mean nothing to me, and i'm certainly not here to tell you mine is better then yours. there is no convincing one or the other on which is "better", it's just beating a dead horse really.... but yes, i didn't jump the gun and configured a MacPro with 32 gigs of ram, but at least thats a lil more realistic then you comparing it to a MacBook laptop! i have a MacBook and yes, i hate it... i use it for watching movies in the living room and browsing the internet in bed also. thats it and that's what they are made for... But to make all this shit even more unnecessary is the simple fact that fast is fast, period. you can keep droppin more ram and speed up your hard drives all you want, but it really comes down to if you click something, it does it and without hesitation. I mean what do you work on all day that needs that kind of power? Honestly, if your doing video work, then by all means cram in the power and go to town. I did video for 3 years and it was like watching paint dry when it came to rendering the video, the extra power would have helped... But come on now, we both design flyers, biz cards, shirts, stickers, signs, banners, etc all day long. Now i can't tell you the last time i went to go work on a project and i was frustrated with how slow my machine was. I never see the spinning dial, ever. when i click it jumps, no hesitation. Now maybe when it comes to initially opening the file, then yes, it takes 20 seconds, whoop... I even design my wraps on this machine and hardly have a hick-up when i'm working on them, my machine runs just fine, even if it does have a stupid apple logo on the front... Now to humor you, for whatever reason... i didn't realize my machines were such a joke that it became funny, but it's whatever.(1) 24" iMac 2.66 GHz Core 2 Duo 4 Gigs DDR3 RamNVIDIA GeForce 94001TB internal drive1TB external mirrored to 2 drives via Firewire 800 (1) 24" iMac 2.8 GHz Core 2 DuoSecond 22" Monitor 4 Gigs DDR2 RamATI Radeon HD 26001TB internal drive Wacom Intuos 3 Tablet And not to mention, i still don't have the ego that comes with having a custom built PC... So u can keep rambling off all the specs and geeky mumbo jumbo you want, but it still comes down to personal preference... and knowing what you got gets the job done regardless of what someone else has...Oh ya... almost for the blazing fast 2.4Ghz, 1 gig, with windows XP to run the PLOTTER, lol ---------------------------------------------I asked what you use because I want to know what you have so I can know what you assume to be fast, I have played with serveral iMacs, they are nice machines. They are still a dual core machine, not earth shattering performance. What your saying is like trying to tell someone a V8 is not faster than a 4 banger. One thing you probably should learn about is disk read/write speed. Thats a huge bottle neck for PC and Mac alike. I over come that by buiding my own machines, trust me, youve never seen fast untill you use SSD drives or 10krpm drives. If you think you have your wrong. Use them and come back and tell me adding ram and hard drives dont make a difference. I certainly didn't mention it to get into a pissing contest or for ego. But I have built computers for around 10 years now. Went to school for computers, and build many a year for friends/familly. I dont hate my Macbook Pro, I just find it has a place, and its not as my main computer. It is slow in contrast. My computer is fast period as well, faster than the mac pro I tinkered with at several 2 mac stores. I am sure they would be quicker with faster hard drives and some more ram. One day I was in the Apple store when I bought my Beats by Dre head phones. I opened photoshop and created a "new" file 50x100 inches at 450dpi, drew a single black to white gradiant, the machine took several minutes. Ill be fair there were several programs open. However I can open many on mine and do the same thing and it happens almost instantly. Maybe something was wrong with it. Ya we do similar things with our computers, however I probably do them for much longer than you as I would have to imagine you have a real job and a social life. I have neither and work 7 days a week 14hrs a day and have been for 8 years now. So if my computer can be faster and I get a business write off in the process, I am all about it. So of course I will build top shelf computers, of course I will have epic hard drives, of course I will have tons of ram, I personally find them to be worth the money and not expensive. its 200 bucks for 12gb of DDR3 ram, why woudln't I buy that much? Thats cheap. Ive never been frustrated with how slow any PC I have had was, I do know when it can be faster, same as 5 minutes after you buy any brand computer some newer model is already in the works with faster this and faster that. I happen to keep up with that curve because I find it fun, and rewarding. See unlike many fan boys of either flavor or any type of product I like to try both. Ived tried Macs, more than one time. They are great computers, for me they do nothing faster, they work with less software, they are drastically harder to repair since if something DOES go wrong you ahve to take it to a store and deal with that. They are more expensive for no real performance gain if you are comparing same specs to same specs. Do they look cooler, sure. Its just like with phones, I had a windows mobile phone. I found it crap, so I have iPhones now. 2 times ive bought iPhones in fact. I dont hate Apple, ive just yet to see a dollar for dollar Apple out perform a PC. Use your Macs, I think Macs are great, I will keep using both, so I can have a real open mind about what really is better. HAHA.
GraphicDisorder
+1y
---------------------------------------------Originally posted by DragaDodgewe need a mod to clean up this thread LOL ---------------------------------------------LUL. At least the photoshop section has some traffic now right? LOL.
DougyFrisch
+1y
For once i whole heartedly agree with your statements... i just take it to heart when a PC guru tells me how much faster their pc is then my macs, when i've never in my life made such a general claim. i'll never say "Macs are faster then PCs" and i'd hope to never hear the opposite... like you said, comparing the two spec to spec doesn't do any good, and nore does dollar for dollar, they are just different in so many ways... i agree, they cost more... i agree, you can't fix em yourself... i agree, you can't use all the same software... i agree, you can't update em as easy... the list goes on and on, but that's where you come in cause you know how to do all that and enjoy it... I myself would rather keep my warranty and just drop my machine off to them for a day IF anything should happen to go wrong... and just to clearify... "I would have to imagine you have a real job and a social life"... My 'real' job is a graphic artist, I run a Sign & Graphics business here in my hometown. Not to mention i'm a part time tattoo apprentice. So when i'm not at the shop designing or doing installs, i'm at the tattoo shop workin... So we both know all about long hours...