2 link controversy....

i curently have two trucks that have two links one has a panhard bar that goes from the frame to the axel and pulls the axel really bad when aired up the other one has a panhard bar that goes from one link bar to the other at an angle. both trucks are four valves no side to side other than normal driving. i havent had any problems with either one but my question is this a bad set up to drive on or just less disirable by reputation.

Originally posted by pootytang



see max, you need to write a book. i'd buy it, i have a couple suspension books and they might as well be in chinese. they talk more about tensil strength of steel than my pea brain can comprehend, i don't plan on becoming a metalurgist. i've taken way more from you're posts than 60 bucks worth of books. i second this

TOWNLOW- I would build a new 4-link that had shorter bars. That way you can still keep the proper geometry and move the front mounts up to correct your severe front to rear axle movement. If you are only using 6" of total travel, you can easily get away with 15" or shorter bars. Keep in mind though that the shorter the bars, the more important correct geometry is.

Josh- I have a hard time getting the point across that a 2-link and the reverse 4-link is wrong without people taking it like I'm bashing their vehicle. So let me try it like this...

Having something "work" is a relative term and to most people it means just what it sounds like. The suspension will work. To me and anyone else that wants their vehicle to perform as best as it can "work" means that the suspension will handle very well and drive very nice. Let use dirt bikes as an example. Pep Boys sells those motorcycles that are made in China, look somewhat like the dirt bikes that you see on the X-games and come in three different colors. They work, you can ride them and they will probably make 90% of the world happy. The other 10% of the world that really are dirt bike riders would never be seen on one of them. They would spend ten times the money on a CR, KX, RM, YZ, KTM... true performance bikes, bikes that are superior in every aspect. Would the other 90% notice the difference between the bikes? Probably. Would they spend the extra money on one? Maybey... At least if they had a chance to ride one of each they could make an informed decision. Maybe the money would be worth it, maybe they wouldn't care. The point is that if you are happy with your suspension, don't go out and change it just cause I said so. If you were planning on building a new suspension, do some homework and see if the extra time/money spent on a nice 4-link is worth it.

you know whats funny to me, and russell can vouch for seeing this. most all of the diesel pusher motor homes i work on have reverse parallel four links. seems crazy on a 50,000 pound vehicle. with air ride(small amount of travel) even the tandom axle ones will have 2 reverse links. wish i had some piks of em. im not condoneing them since ive had one and they can get scary sometimes with too much lift. jus figured id throw that out there

for the record a diesel pusher is a 40-45' motorhome with a large diesel motor behind the axle

I am not entering an opinion of pro or con for 2-links but has anyone ridden in an HHR? They have 2-links. Call it a control arm, trailing arm, swing arm...whatever, it's a 2-link. As a matter of fact, the design is the same as the 2-link in the very 1st post.

I bagged one recently and thought about changing it but decided to see what it had to offer. I have to say I was rather impressed but that is probably largely biased due to the fact that I have witnessed so much 2-link bashing on SSM.

Originally posted by mreed



I am not entering an opinion of pro or con for 2-links but has anyone ridden in an HHR? They have 2-links. Call it a control arm, trailing arm, swing arm...whatever, it's a 2-link. As a matter of fact, the design is the same as the 2-link in the very 1st post.

I can assure you that it is not a two link. FWD cars that use a beam rear axle have twist in either the beam or the trailing arms or both. Sorry, unless you design a rear axles with a pumpkin that will twist and allow articulation, its not the same as a thick walled 2 link.

a lot of people try to compare apples to oranges "a semi truck has a two link" no it doesnt, but remind me again how many times you hauled 18 tons. "nascar uses a two link" no, it doesnt, and remind me how many times you drove your bagged truck on a banked road and only turned left? "chevy used a two link on their 60-72 trucks" no, they didnt, and even if they did, remind me again what year it is?

Its like saying that because a weight lifter can lift 1000 lbs, I can too because I have two arms and he has two arms.

Now I havent seen the reverse setups on motorhomes, but if I had to guess its is so the axle follws the arc of the driveshaft coming from the rear. I also havent ever seen a motorhome trying to navigate normal traffic with the same speed and agility of a car or truck, they are usually loafing on the highway and generally getting in everyones way.



Do I care what you put on your truck? no. I have seen more half assed 3 and 4 link installs than non working two links. I have seen more pretty 3 and 4 link installs that work worse than a two link. Make an informed decision is what I am saying. Dont read the book "everything my buddy taught me" because buddys are frequently wrong. Unless your buddy is max of course.

I like the people that do 2-links just to spite people that don't like them. To me it doesn't get much more ignorant than that.

I would much rather spend the money and time doing a proper 4-link than a 2-link. Just my opinion though.

A lot of good points raised by some very knowledgeable people in this thread.

Originally posted by BioMax



A 4-link is only considered a suspension design to minitruckers, there isn't a book out there that would even acknowledge it.



I don't understand this one. Could you elaborate? More on the only a suspension design to mini truckers, not the book part. Thanks.

^^^^ I'm pretty sure he meant 2-link and put 4 on accident

Originally posted by KAOSS



Originally posted by BioMax



A 4-link is only considered a suspension design to minitruckers, there isn't a book out there that would even acknowledge it.



I don't understand this one. Could you elaborate? More on the only a suspension design to mini truckers, not the book part. Thanks.

I'm sorry I meant that the REVERSE 4-link is not an accepted suspension design.

I'm with Russ on this one. Any factory "2-link" cannot be compared to a garage designed 2-link because the engineers involved have incorporated an allowable amount of flex in the system so that the suspension can articulate within the suspensions design travel. And an RV has V-E-R-Y different needs than a passenger car or truck. When you bag your vehicle, do you hope the whole time you're building it that is drives like an RV?

"Dude that would be awesome wouldn't it? If this this thing handled like a diesel-pusher when it was done. God, I can't wait!"

I just don't see that happening.